CNN "Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees" - Transcript

Interview

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Congressman, do you have any doubt in your mind that what Congresswoman Bachmann and the others are doing is simply scare mongering? Because it seems -- they're casting doubt on basically anyone who's Muslim and working for the U.S. government.

REP. KEITH ELLISON (D), MINNESOTA: I have no doubt that it's simply scare-mongering. But I think it has a long historic route.

And we've seen this kind of thing before so we've got to stand to it whenever it rears its end. I mean, when Edward R. Murrow challenged Joe McCarthy, he wasn't standing up for communism. He was standing up for American values.

And I'm not standing up for any particular religious group. I'm standing up for America's freedom of thought in America today and that, you know, just simply being a member of a particular religious group does not make you radioactive.

COOPER: You asked for a full accounting of the evidence these members of Congress were using to make their claims. You got a 16- page letter back. Does their evidence hold up?

ELLISON: No, it's 16 pages worth of nothing. It's 16 pages worth of repeated false allegations. Just regurgitated nonsense. And, you know, it doesn't -- 16 pages doesn't take nothing and turn it into something. It's still nothing.

And the fact is I would hope that we would just let our saner, more courageous spirit prevail. And say look, you know, in America, everybody counts. Everybody matters. People can be included. People can be a part our American political scene without fear. And that's what I'm standing up against here.

COOPER: I mean, have you seen any evidence of deep penetration, that was the words that Congressman Bachmann used. Deep penetration by the Muslim Brotherhood into the security apparatus of the United States?

ELLISON: No, it's not true. It doesn't exist. It's a phantom. And -- but, look, let me also assert that if there's any, any source of threat to the United States, legitimate, you know, then I want them to be fully investigated, whatever source. I don't care what religion, what race, what -- whoever they are. If they're a legitimate threat to the U.S., by all means investigate them. But in this case, there is none that I have ever seen.

COOPER: Bachmann in particular raises questions about Hillary Clinton's, one of her top aides, Huma Abedin who's Muslim.

ELLISON: Yes.

COOPER: Married to former Congressman Anthony Weiner. He's obviously a very supporter of Israel.

ELLISON: Right.

COOPER: Basically they're saying that Huma Abedin's dead father headed a group decades ago. And one of the people who supposedly supported that group headed another group that was supposedly connected to the Muslim Brotherhood.

I mean, does that make any sense to you? That she shouldn't have gotten a security clearance because of that?

ELLISON: I think it just is the worst of guilt by association. It is -- it is a stark affront to American values about treating people for what they did and how they behave themselves. Not try to attribute some other people's behavior to the individual.

I think that -- I think it's really reprehensible and I do hope that there is -- that people stand up to it. Because let me tell you, Anderson, you know this. Good people were afraid to question Joe McCarthy because they thought he would be their target. But this is an occasion where good people got to stand up and say we've seen this before. We're not going to let it happen again.

COOPER: If you really believed there is this insidious security threat into the highest reaches of government, is that really something, as a Congress person, you make public? You go on some conservative radio show? You write a public letter and put it on your Web site? Or is that something you actually contact, you know, Homeland Security and FBI, and ask for a secret investigation by which Congress people can do?

If you really believe there's been this infiltration, do you really alert the people you're allegedly concerned about? To me it seems like this could be more about politics and about kind of making a stand, a very public stand, for political reasons, than it is about genuine security concerns.

ELLISON: You know, Anderson, I made this very point. I said, look, if she really believes this, why is she broadcasting it? She should go to the responsible authorities to investigate it. But that's not what she's done. She's made sure that the public got a full viewing of her behavior. And I think the reason she did it is she thinks that it's going to be popular and she's going to make herself look like some sort of a hero and this may benefit her in her election.

I don't know what's in the mind of Michele Bachmann at this time. But I can tell you that it's not only about this election, although it's going to have a defectiveness election. It's deeper than that. It's about some people in our country thinking that if you're not in the, quote/unquote, "mainstream," then you have no place. That you have to be a certain color, a certain race, a sexual orientation, a certain religion.

And if you're not the right ones, then you're not OK. But we've got to stand up for this idea that we all count in this America. In America an American is an American. And we're going to stick with this idea. We're not going to back down.

COOPER: Grover Norquist himself, when he was being attacked by Frank Gaffney on this without any evidence, said this is about religious liberty and...

ELLISON: Yes. He's right.

COOPER: To practice in this country. Congressman Keith Ellison, I appreciate you're being on. Thank you.

ELLISON: Thank you.

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