MSNBC "Morning Joe" - Transcript

Interview

MSNBC "Morning Joe" - Transcript

MSNBC "Morning Joe" Interview With Senator Barbara Boxer (D-CA)

Subject: California Economy, Nomination of Sonia Sotomayor, Gay Marriage Issue

Interviewers: Joe Scarborough, Mika Brzezinski, Willie Geist, Mike Barnicle

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MR. SCARBOROUGH: But we've got somebody here that's going to help us sort through it all.

MR. BARNICLE: Good thing. Good thing.

MS. BRZEZINSKI: We could -- you could really figure it out today.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: Democratic Senator from California and the chair of the Environment and Public Works Committee, Senator Barbara Boxer. She's also a member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.

Let's --

SEN. BOXER: Wait a minute! We are not a basket case in California.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: Economic basket case.

SEN. BOXER: We are in trouble --

MR. : (Whistles.)

SEN. BOXER: -- and we're going to get out of that trouble. And we're the greatest state in the Union, the most beautiful state, the most dynamic state, the most cutting-edge state, the most diverse state.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: And about 50 billion (dollars) short.

MS. BRZEZINSKI: (Inaudible.)

SEN. BOXER: Just -- we're just about 20 billion (dollars) short. Don't make it worse than it is. (Laughter.)

MS. BRZEZINSKI: It's all right!

MR. SCARBOROUGH: It's pretty bad, though.

SEN. BOXER: It's not good.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: What has happened over the past 20 years?

SEN. BOXER: Well, I don't think you need to go back 20 years to know what has happened.

I think we had some very good times in our state, and we decided we wanted to invest more in our kids, in our people, in our environment and everything else. The recession hit, and the revenues really went down.

When Arnold Schwarzenegger became governor, he repealed some sources of revenue -- which he now is trying to restore, but the people said no.

So it's kind of a nightmare scenario, because you need two-thirds to pass a budget in our state, which is a recipe for paralysis. So every little thing that they decide they're going to do, they have to put it on the ballot first, instead of just taking the heat and fixing the problem.

So it's a dysfunctional system.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: That does -- some would say a basket case.

SEN. BOXER: No, I would call it a dysfunctional system. It's a dysfunctional system.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: It is dysfunctional. Putting all those things on the ballot is just --

SEN. BOXER: Crazy. And people are saying, and rightly so, isn't that why I elect you, California State Senate and California Assembly and Governor Schwarzenegger? Why are you making us make a decision as to how to solve the crisis?

So it's dysfunctional, and it must change.

MR. BARNICLE: When you run statewide -- and you're up for reelection in about 18 months or -- how much of the issues that are raised by people who come to your rallies, who come to hear you speak, are rooted in what happened in California -- what, nearly 20 years ago, with capping the property taxes?

Remember that proposition? Government by proposition.

SEN. BOXER: Yes.

MR. BARNICLE: How much of the issue today, the problem today, is rooted in that?

SEN. BOXER: It is a problem. The people love the system, but the fact is it's very hard to govern via initiative.

And it's gone now to this next level, where now just the everyday budget issues are being put up there. So it's a major problem.

But when I run, to be honest, people make a distinction -- and I do -- between what's happening in the state and my work at the federal level, which involves war and peace and greenhouse gas policy for the whole country. And, right now, trying to be a partner for change with our president.

So there are distinctions, but people are very grumpy, and California rightly so, and they're upset.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: Well -- and Mike, you're not suggesting that California should pay more taxes, are you? Because my God, the only place where people are taxed as much as we are here in Manhattan -- in California.

MR. BARNICLE: No. No, I'm not suggesting that the put more taxes.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: There's just no more -- (inaudible).

(Cross talk.)

MR. BARNICLE: I just think that part of the problem out there is that every initiative ends up on the ballot, rather than in the legislature with some courage.

SEN. BOXER: Yeah. It's a punting. That's exactly the question.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: Could it be that California has tried to do too much, tried to spend too money, busted their budget, tried to be all things to all people and, in the end, they just can't afford to pay the bill at the end of the day.

SEN. BOXER: Well, certainly it's part of it. There's -- part of it is that in very good times, there were a lot of ongoing investments made, rather than a one-time expenditure, which I think is right.

In good times, you should do some capital improvements, but the operating costs -- you've got to look out for. But it's a number of things that have happened.

But if I would just sum it up, in California we have a huge divide between Republicans and Democrats. It's just -- it's enormous.

It kind of mirrors the divide between Bernie Sanders in the United States Senate, who I would say is to my left, and going all the way to the right, I'll pick on Jim DeMint. The two of them just -- they really see the world very differently.

And that's the divide we have in the California -- in California politics in the state level. So they don't talk to each other.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: By the way, Jim DeMint would take it as a compliment, to be on the other side of a socialist.

SEN. BOXER: And so would Bernie. And Bernie.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: Yeah, and so would Bernie. No doubt about it.

SEN. BOXER: Bernie's an Independent, and Bernie is very strong on --

MR. SCARBOROUGH: Doesn't he call himself a socialist, an independent socialist?

SEN. BOXER: I don't know; you'd have to ask him.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: I think he did.

SEN. BOXER: But he is an Independent in the --

MR. SCARBOROUGH: Republicans run around calling everybody socialists. I think Bernie --

MR. BARNICLE: He's proud of it.

(Cross talk.)

MR. SCARBOROUGH: -- (inaudible) -- was in the House was proud of it.

MR. BARNICLE: Yeah. Yeah.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: And he's from Vermont.

SEN. BOXER: Bernie's from Vermont. He's very popular.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: He is.

SEN. BOXER: But the point is the divide between those two, getting back to our topic, reminds me of the divide between most Democrats and Republicans in California.

So what happens is they don't trust each other, they don't talk, and everything goes on the ballot.

And I think the people there, rightly so, are saying, I can't decide whether to raise this tax a half a percent or cut this program a quarter of a percent. That's your job, legislature. And that's why it's dysfunctional.

MS. BRZEZINSKI: I want to move to national news here, and Sonia Sotomayor.

SEN. BOXER: Yes.

MS. BRZEZINSKI: What do you make of the recent line of attacks against her that have come from the right, in terms of her being a reverse racist and other concerns?

MR. SCARBOROUGH: A reverse racist. And Newt Gingrich accused her of new racism -- yesterday.

SEN. BOXER: Well, I'm not at all surprised. When I went after former Secretary of State Condi Rice about the war, the right wing machine, everywhere from the radio stations all the way to the floor of the Senate said I had made a huge mistake and I was anti-female. I was no longer someone who supported women's -- women.

So that's what they do. It says a lot more about them than it does about the judge, and I think they are going to really get a backlash.

It's absolutely ridiculous. This is a woman who struggled; who is, yes, empathetic and understands that you have to fight for your rights in this country. You also have to work very hard.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: Right.

SEN. BOXER: And her life story's beautiful. And to say that it turned her into a racist, there's -- if you look at her body of decisions, and there are so many, you don't find that at all.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: Yeah.

SEN. BOXER: You find her to be a very mainstream judge.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: Well, Willie, we're emphatic (sic).

MR. GEIST: We are?

MS. BRZEZINSKI: Empathetic?

(Cross talk.)

MR. GEIST: (Inaudible.) Speaking of that, quickly, before --

SEN. BOXER: And you're emphatic. (Laughter.)

MR. GEIST: Both. I'm emphatically empathetic.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: We're emphatically empathetic.

MR. GEIST: Before we let you go, I have to quickly ask you your reaction to the Supreme Court in your state upholding the ban on gay marriage, Proposition 8.

MS. BRZEZINSKI: Yes.

SEN. BOXER: Sure. Well, I'm very sad about this decision because they got it right the first time when they said that same-sex couples should have equal rights. It was a very lofty decision, and it was written by a Republican, Ron George. I thought it was -- it really said what America's about: equality for all.

Now they kind of said, well, if you got married before Prop 8 it's okay, but if you didn't, you can't get married. And I look at that as denial of equal protection under the law.

So where does this leave us? It means we have to go back and battle it out at the ballot box, and I will be right up there, whatever the fallout is for me.

I just feel really bad for so many people. All they want to do is take care of someone, someone else that they really care about. And it just seems that --

MR. GEIST: Yeah. So another proposition?

SEN. BOXER: Oh, yes, my friend. Oh, yeah -- (inaudible) -- another one.

(Cross talk, laughter.)

MR. SCARBOROUGH: Willie Geist, who is so mad. Let's just keep it in California and not federalize the issue, and we'll all be happy.

MS. BRZEZINSKI: Okay. Senator Boxer, it's --

SEN. BOXER: Well, marriage is a state issue, Joe.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: It is. Exactly.

SEN. BOXER: It is. It always has been.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: All these people that want to nationalize this issue, and let's ban gay marriage nationwide or let's allow gay marriage -- yeah, it's a state issue.

SEN. BOXER: It's a state-by-state --

MS. BRZEZINSKI: Now they're fighting in a federal court --

SEN. BOXER: And I think our state will come out on the right side of history, but it will be another struggle and battle, and I'll look forward to being involved in the side of equal rights.

MR. SCARBOROUGH: All right. (Laughs.)

MS. BRZEZINSKI: Thank you very, very much. Nice to have you in the studio.

SEN. BOXER: Thanks. Good to see you.

END.

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