Hearing of the Senate Armed Services Committee - The Situation in Iraq and Progress by the Government of Iraq in Meeting Benchmarks and Achieving Reconciliation

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SEN. MEL MARTINEZ (R-FL): Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

Gentlemen, thank you both very much for your excellent service to our country. I also want to remark how dramatic a difference it is from today and the reports that you bring us, General Petraeus, from what we had seen when we were last together here in September. I think it's undeniable that dramatic and significant progress have been made, that particularly as it relates to al Qaeda. And for that, I think you both should be strongly commended, and we thank you.

Ambassador Crocker, if I may follow up on the status of forces agreement, I would like to just have you explain to the committee -- first of all, it isn't your prerogative about what course this follows in terms of whether it comes to the Congress or not.

Is that not correct?

AMB. CROCKER: Senator, it would depend on the elements --

SEN. MARTINEZ: Of the agreement.

AMB. CROCKER: -- of the agreement.

SEN. MARTINEZ: And in fact, these are routinely done between the United States and allied countries where we may have forces stationed.

AMB. CROCKER: Yes, sir. There are more than 80 of them, and as the chairman noted, only the NATO status of forces agreement has gone before the Senate because of its -- the special commitments that we undertook in that.

SEN. MARTINEZ: So other than NATO, these do not necessarily or ever come before the Senate. So in other words, it's nothing unusual for this one not to come before the Senate because others do not as well.

AMB. CROCKER: That's correct, sir.

SEN. MARTINEZ: Let me ask you, if I may, about the diplomatic interaction with Iran. I know that I continue to be concerned, as I know you are, about their involvement. The December 18th talks have been suspended or postponed. Can you tell us about the status of those potential conversations with Iran going into the future?

AMB. CROCKER: Several days ago, the Iraqi foreign ministry announced that they were working on arrangements for another round of talks. We have indicated to the Iraqi government previously that we would be prepared to participate in such talks at the request of the Iraqi government and if in the judgment of the Iraqi government they might possibly improve the security situation. So as it stands now, the government of Iraq is making efforts to see if it can schedule something. And if they can, we'll be there.

SEN. MARTINEZ: But the government of Iran seems to be a little reticent to engage in these talks, is that what I hear from you?

AMB. CROCKER: Yes, sir. We've been through a number of efforts since December, as you point out, and each time something seems to get in the way of the Iranian schedulers.

SEN. MARTINEZ: I know for a long time, we talked about the need to first to engage and talk to Iran. I guess it's difficult to talk to someone that doesn't want to talk back or whose actions may not be in good faith. And in that regard, General Petraeus, can you -- you mentioned earlier about 107 millimeter rockets that were being fired upon the international zone in Baghdad. Do we have nay idea where the insurgent groups in Iraq are getting these 107 millimeter rockets to fire?

GEN. PETRAEUS: They come from Iran, Senator. As I mentioned, we have found large numbers of them in weapons caches. We recently, in fact, jut south of Baghdad found 45 more in a single weapons cache that also had several thousand pounds of explosives in it. They have come from Iran. There's no question about it, and we have individuals in detention who have explained the entire process that goes on with the special groups, how they are brought over there, how they are recruited, trained, how they're funded. And we've captured, in fact, the -- again, as I mentioned, one of the senior heads of the special groups and a number of other -- of their leaders and financiers, all of whom were, again, supported by the Iranian Qods Force. And we, as you know, also have members of the Qods Force in detention.

SEN. MARTINEZ: So they are participating -- the Qods Force from Iran is participating in recruitment, training, financing, all but the execution, and I suppose even in some instances maybe the execution of attacks upon our forces as well.

GEN. PETRAEUS: I can't speak to the execution directly. There's a clear sense that there has been direction of attacks and of dialing up and dialing down at different times.

SEN. MARTINEZ: Now, we've heard some discussion recently in the media that perhaps Iran had had a role in the truce, as it was called, in Basra in recent days. Can you comment on that?

AMB. CROCKER: Senator, there has been speculation. I would have to say honestly I simply don't know. I think the statement by Muqtada Sadr can be explained in Iraqi terms, just as his original cease-fire announcement in August and its renewal in February were. I think that he and the other members of the Sadr political trend are as aware as anyone that the Jaish al-Mahdi special groups activities politically did not play to their advantage at all.

And what we've maybe seen through the statement and through some of his subsequent actions and statements is an effort to distance himself from those extremist elements. I think that would make sense. The Sadr movement in its inception touched a deep vein in Iraq. It was populist. It was Iraqi nationalist; it was Arab nationalist. It's kind of lost its moorings somewhat in recent years, with this gravitation toward Iran.

What we may be seeing now, if you're explaining this in Iraqi terms, is an effort to move away from the Iranian-backed and I would say controlled special groups and move back into the Iraqi political forum. I would certainly hope that's the case.

SEN. MARTINEZ: My time is up, but I would like to just close with a comment that some would suggest that we should withdraw the troops from Iraq so that we might send them to Afghanistan. I would really prefer to see our NATO partners pick up their share of the load in Afghanistan rather than just shift our troops from one country to another.

Thank you both very much. I admire greatly the work that you're doing.

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