MSNBC Hardball - Transcript

MSNBC  

SHOW: HARDBALL 21:00

BYLINE: Chris Matthews; David Shuster

GUESTS: Saxby Chambliss; Frank Lautenberg; Richard Miniter; Arnold Schwarzenegger; Dianne Feinstein

HIGHLIGHT:
HARDBALL for September 3, 2003, MSNBC

BODY:
MATTHEWS: Joining us right now, Senator Dianne Feinstein, Democrat from California. Senator Feinstein, thank you for doing the program tonight. But, let me ask you the big question I asked Arnold Schwarzenegger. Is it relevant what he said in a magazine article 30 some years ago in this campaign?

SENATOR DIANNE FEINSTEIN (D)-CALIFORNIA: Well, I'm not going to say whether it's relevant or not, but he didn't answer your question. He didn't say whether the article was true or false.

(CROSSTALK)

MATTHEWS: No. My question was, did he change in 30 years. I never asked him if the article was true or false. He's never denied that. I asked him if he's changed as a man in 30 years. If he's the same person he was, and he says no. Is that good enough for you?

FEINSTEIN: Well, I don't think so. I listened to that part of it. I don't think group sex justifies promoting a movie. If that's what he was saying.

MATTHEWS: Yes. So you're thinking -- he says --

(CROSSTALK)

FEINSTEIN: So I don't have a great appreciation for that kind of thing, I'm afraid.

MATTHEWS: I get that. Let me ask you about the question of his blaming the Democrats in Sacramento for the big deficits that you face up there, the $38 billion deficit out here in California. Is that a fair charge? The Democrats who control the legislature, control the governor's office, are responsible for the deficit.

FEINSTEIN: Well, there is a deficit. I think everybody shares in it. But, one of the real problems in this deficit has been a dramatic revenue loss, the biggest part of which was caused by the bursting of the Silicon Valley bubble. Now, interestingly enough, revenues are up the first seven months of this year over the last -- first seven months of last year by about a $1,350,000,000. That's good news. That is about a three percent increase so far in revenues. So I think it shows that the state is recovering and it will recover. Let there be no doubt. In the meantime.

MATTHEWS: Yes. But then spending -- he said spending is the cause. Has spending increased under Governor Davis?

FEINSTEIN: Yes. Of course. But he also gave no specifics as to what he would do and how he would remedy the structural problem in the deficit. What he would cut precisely. That seems to me, that when you run for governor of this state, and you're about a month before the election, you have an obligation to tell the people to a known problem, exactly what you would do, what you would cut. And not only that, but I noticed -- here a movie action hero and he's going to duck the first debate.

MATTHEWS: OK. Let me ask you, Senator, do you believe Governor Gray Davis, the incumbent Democrat who is facing a recall and is very down in the polls. Do you believe he has been a good governor for California?

FEINSTEIN: I think he's been a good governor for California. I think many good things have happened. Particularly education, many environmental programs that have been good for the state. The economy was doing very well up to recently. The state was producing jobs.

MATTHEWS: Has he been good to you as a Democratic colleague over the years? Has he treated you with respect as a colleague as much as you're treating him with respect now?

FEINSTEIN: Increasingly so. I'll say that.

MATTHEWS: Well, let's take a look at his ad he ran against you in 1992.

FEINSTEIN: Oh, please.

MATTHEWS: Let's take a look. It's part of history.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOVERNOR GRAY DAVIS (D)-CALIFORNIA: Leona Helmsley and Dianne Feinstein?

Helmsley is in jail. Feinstein wants to be a Senator?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTHEWS: What do you make of that ad?

FEINSTEIN: Well, it wasn't one of his better moments.

MATTHEWS: Well, how can you forgive a guy.

FEINSTEIN: It was terrible.

MATTHEWS: . you're out there stumping for a guy who compared you to a felon.

FEINSTEIN: Well, now, wait a second. What I'm saying is this governor should not be recalled from office. There is no gross malfeasance. There is no gross incompetence. There is no reason to recall him. And recalling him in this way causes the state, I believe, enormous problems.

MATTHEWS: I know. I agree with that.

FEINSTEIN: And not the least of which is this election.

MATTHEWS: I agree with that concern.

FEINSTEIN: So there is a good reason to be against the recall.

MATTHEWS: I agree with that. We had a focus group here last night, Senator. You know how they work. You interview a bunch of people from different perspectives. We had about 40 some people here. All different stripes, politically, from what we could tell. Ethnic backgrounds and such.

And I asked them if - on the air last night - if any of them thought that things were going OK in Sacramento. That they thought that the establishment up there, this legislator and the governor together have done a decent job. And to the one, every single one of them said they've done a bad job.

FEINSTEIN: Well, if the economy were good, they would say something else. The economy has been bad and so they blame everybody. And it's like anything else. When things are good, you get a little share of the plaudit, and when it's bad, you take the blame. And there are some things you change, and some things you can't.

Now, could the governor have probably worked better with the legislator? I think so. There's a problem on one side, you have Democratic Party, very liberal. You have the Republican Party very conservative. So there's sort of a polarization. It makes it difficult to pull the two sides together. But a lot of very positive things have happened, I believe. And problems are being solved.

Now, the question is, can people with no experience in government, not knowing one thing about many of the critical programs, come in in the middle of a session and make a tangible and positive difference? I think it is extraordinarily difficult in that situation. And I think it will leave a lot of bad blood.

In our business, what we do, what goes around, comes around. And recall for political reasons, and nobody should think it is anything other than that. Recall for political reasons, if it gets started that way, I think will have bad dividends through and through, all across this nation. So my view is, nip it in the bud. Say no. Californians, vote no.

MATTHEWS: Why do you think polls show that most Californians support a recall of this governor? Not just the far right, but most people?

FEINSTEIN: I suspect the polls are beginning to change. There's some evidence of that already. I think, as people see the race, as they see the candidates, they're beginning to think, well, I think what we have isn't so bad after all. I think a recall would be a mistake.

You know, there's a value. I've run for governor, campaigned for two years. I know what it is like to do it. The state is so big that you can't just get out there with plaudit and no recognition of the diversity of the differences in constituencies of the many needs of this state and say, you know, I'm going to be a broom and sweep clean. Or hasta la vista, baby. It doesn't solve anything.

MATTHEWS: Well, why then, if you're confident that this governor can do the job in California and deal with the fiscal crisis that everyone knows isn't all his fault, how come you didn't even mention his name in the ads you've been running in the state. Did you simply come out against the recall?

FEINSTEIN: Well, in the first place, I wrote that for the most part, and what I was asked to do is essentially say what I said on "Meet The Press." And so I tried to take my -- those basic thoughts and simply put it down.

MATTHEWS: Well, let's take a look.

FEINSTEIN: And everybody knows what I'm talking about.

MATTHEWS: Well, let's take a look at your ad. It's running all over the state. Here it is. Dianne Feinstein's ad against the recall.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

FEINSTEIN: This governor was reelected just last November. Within three months, this recall effort began. It was started by people who were unhappy with the results of a legitimate election in which 8 million Californians voted. It is producing uncertainty and instability. It is bad for the economy, bad for jobs, and bad for California. That's why I'm voting no. I hope you will be too.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTHEWS: Do you think people change, Senator Feinstein, over life?

FEINSTEIN: Yes, I do believe people change.

MATTHEWS: And do you think, Senator, do you think that Arnold Schwarzenegger is a different man than he was 30 years ago? And I asked you the same question politically. Do you think that the governor of your state - of this state I am in right now - can change in his public manifestation, the way people see him dramatically in the next four or five weeks so that people thing differently of him?

FEINSTEIN: I can't speak to Arnold Schwarzenegger. I've only met him once and I don't know him. I can speak for the governor. I believe he has changed. I believe this experience has been a huge change in his life. I think he has had to come to grips with a number of things. I find, in my conversations with him, he is a very different man than I knew him to be, well let's say, when he ran against me in the Senate primary in 1992.

MATTHEWS: Right. Has he ever apologized for that ad - has he ever apologized for that ad against you, calling you Leona Helmsly?

FEINSTEIN: Well, that's not really relevant. Why do we need to go into that now? I mean, it's over. I won by 26 points. That's pretty good.

MATTHEWS: Well, you're great. I don't think he is. You wouldn't have run an ad like that. Anyway, thank you very much, Senator Feinstein, for.

FEINSTEIN: And you are very welcome.

MATTHEWS: . standing up for the governor of California against the recall.