FOX "Fox News Sunday with Chris Wallace" - Transcript: Economy, Health Care, and Privacy

Interview

SEN. RAND PAUL, R-KY.: Good morning.

WALLACE: Before we get to ObamaCare, I want to talk to you about your trip to Detroit this week where you helped open the first of what are going to be several Republican outreach centers in inner cities. You also unveiled your plan for economic freedom zones in depressed areas.

Let's take a look at that plan.

You would set a flat individual and corporate tax rate in those depressed areas of 5 percent. Give parents more school choice and education tax credits. And loosen visa rules to encourage foreign entrepreneurs to open businesses.

Senator, critics say, well, those are all good ideas. You've got to pour more government money into those inner cities if you're going to make a difference.

PAUL: Well, Chris, it hasn't worked. I mean, the president poured $1 trillion into the nation's economy. And when you divided it out, it was about $400,000 per job.

The problem with a government stimulus is you pick the winners and losers. With this stimulus that I'm talking about, a free market stimulus, you simply leave the money in the hands of those who earned it. So the customers have actually picked out the successful people, the ones they choose to buy products from. Those people get more money.

Like I met a young man, young African-American man, who has his own restaurant. His first question is, do you have any tax breaks for me for my business?

That's what this would do. It would help people who are already in business and trying.

WALLACE: But I don't have to tell you, Senator, that Republicans have a steep hill to climb in inner city neighborhoods. In the city of Detroit in November, 97 percent of Detroit voters supported President Obama, 2 percent voted for Romney. The black unemployment rate nationally is still 12.5 percent. And right now, President Obama is calling out the GOP for what he says is your party's refusal to extend long-term unemployment benefits.

Take a look at what he said this week. (BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: For decades, Congress has voted to offer relief to job seekers, including when the unemployment rate was lower than it is today. But now, that economic lifeline is in jeopardy, all because Republicans in this Congress, which is on track to be the most unproductive in history, have so far refused to extend it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WALLACE: Senator, let me ask you a direct question. Do you personally, do you support extending unemployment benefits, or would you let 1.3 million Americans lose those benefits before the end of the year?

PAUL: I do support unemployment benefits for the 26 weeks that they're paid for. If you extend it beyond that, you do a disservice to these workers.

There was a study that came out a few months ago, and it said, if you have a worker that's been unemployed for four weeks and on unemployment insurance and one that's on 99 weeks, which would you hire? Every employer, nearly 100 percent, said they will always hire the person who's been out of work four weeks.

When you allow people to be on unemployment insurance for 99 weeks, you're causing them to become part of this perpetual unemployed group in our economy. And it really -- while it seems good, it actually does a disservice to the people you're trying to help.

You know, I don't doubt the president's motives. But black unemployment in America is double white unemployment. And it hasn't budged under this president.

WALLACE: But, Senator --

PAUL: I think a lot of African-Americans voted for him, but I don't think it's worked. I don't think his policies have worked.

WALLACE: But, Senator, how do you persuade the African-American voter in the inner city, you're not going to spend more government money, you're going to vote to let the -- the unemployment benefits lapse, how do you persuade that black voter, this is good for them? This is the right policy?

PAUL: My economic stimulus plan for Detroit would leave over a billion dollars in Detroit's economy and would stimulate Detroit. There is no other plan on the table. And there's not going to be some grand bail out that's going to go through Congress. Other than my plan, if my plan would pass, I think it's the only one that politically could pass.

Over a billion dollars would be left in Detroit. I'm also talking about restoring voting rights. I'm talking about school choice. I think there's a lot to offer in the Republican message that hasn't been offered in the past. And I think there's only upside potential for voters in Detroit or all the big cities for Republicans.

WALLACE: Senator, you face the same challenge when it comes to ObamaCare. You and most of your colleagues in the Senate and the House, Republican colleagues, want to repeal the law. But the other side says that if you were to do that, that you would take away preventative care for 105 million Americans, free preventative care.

Let's put it up on the screen. ObamaCare provides health services to 105 million Americans, including free immunization for children, free cancer screenings, free mammograms.

Question: what is your plan that would allow these folks, the 105 million Americans, to keep those benefits?

PAUL: First of all, there is nothing for free. You're going to pay for it. We're paying for it through higher premiums.

We're also going to find out in January that more people will lose their insurance under ObamaCare, I think, than will actually gain it. The Republican plan is freedom of choice -- more choices, not less. ObamaCare narrows your choices.

We're for competition. We're for selling insurance across state lines. And above all, we're for driving premiums down.

The problem under the old system was premiums were too high. Under ObamaCare, the premiums are even higher. I don't see any way ObamaCare can work.

WALLACE: Let me turn to another subject: drones. Last March, you famously took to the senate floor for 13 hours to filibuster a nomination because of your opposition to the military use of drones to attack U.S. citizens. This week, as I'm sure you know, Jeff Bezos, the head -- we're looking at a picture of the drone right there -- of Amazon announced that they have plans, a hope, maybe five years down the road, that drones would come pick up a package, a book, a sweater, and deliver it to your front door where you could -- you could take it instead of a delivery truck.

When you see that, and I'm sure you have seen those videos, does that excite you or do you think to yourself, "That's a problem and I've got to find a way to block it"?

PAUL: Well, you know, I'm not against technology. So, I'm not one of these people who says, "Oh, unmanned airplanes is really a bad thing." There will be air traffic control issues. My problem is more with surveillance for privacy reasons.

PAUL: Not with delivering of packages. So, I'm worried about the government looking into our backyard. I'm also worried about private companies looking and counting and looking in our windows.

And I have said previously, and this has nothing to do with Amazon, but that a rules on peeping toms will have to be applied to higher technology. There has to be a certain extension of your privacy. Not only your house, but your yard and the things that you do that really people shouldn't be able to observe all of the time.

And so, there will have to be rules on private entities, but really most particularly I'm concerned about the government looking at our activities.

WALLACE: We also learned this week, another revelation from Edward Snowden, that the NSA collects records on cell phones, 4 billion cell phone records outside the country every day. And that they can also track where those cell phones are so they can track where people are.

Big picture: how severely would you like to restrict the surveillance by the National Security Agency?

PAUL: I would like to apply the Fourth Amendment to third-party records. I don't think you give up your privacy when someone else holds your records. So, when I have a contract with a phone company, I think those are still my records. And you can look at them if you're from the government if you ask a judge.

But the most important thing is, a warrant applies to one person. A warrant doesn't apply to everyone in America. So, it's absolutely against the spirit and the letter of the Fourth Amendment to say that a judge can write one warrant and you can get every phone call in America. That's what's happening.

I think it's wrong. It goes against everything America stands for.

And I will help to fight that all the way to the Supreme Court. And we need the Supreme Court to re-examine privacy, the Fourth Amendment and our records.

WALLACE: So, you would ban, if you could, mass data mining -- this kind of huge vacuum hovering up of information?

PAUL: I'm for going after terrorists with every tool we have. I'm not opposed to the NSA. I'm not opposed to spying. But I am in favor of the Fourth Amendment.

So, if we think someone's a terrorist, you call a judge. You get a warrant. If that person's called 100 people, you get 100 more warrants. If they've called 10,000 people, you got to get 10,000 individual warrants.

And it's a pain. But it's a pain because we're trying to protect people's freedom. We're trying to protect the Bill of Rights.

That's what we're fighting against terrorism to protect. So, we can't give up the Bill of Rights in order to try to fight terrorism. You have to keep your privacy. You have to keep the Bill of Rights.

WALLACE: Finally, Senator, you knew I was going to ask about this. 2016, you said this week your wife, Kelley, is strongly opposed to your running for president. I know how important that is if your wife doesn't like an idea. But you said you're going to try to, quote, "persuade her during the next year."

I got to say, talking to you on camera and off, I get the distinct impression you would like to run for president.

PAUL: Well, you know, the thought has crossed my mind, Chris. And I am seriously thinking about it.

But I'm also very serious about the family considerations. And, you know, just -- just look at what happens daily to any politician in America. You talk about how uncivil things are. I mean, they really are. They do take a toll on family.

And so, it is a big consideration. And I really am not sure what will happen. And we'll go another year.

Sometimes, you have a good week. The next week, they pound you to death. You know, the haters and the hacks go after you. It's like, you know, it is really an ordeal to be in public life sometimes.

There are great things to be part of the debate over the Fourth Amendment in the Constitution. I love that stuff.

But I also hate it, when you, when family is attacked, and when they get into the news and so do they.

WALLACE: Well, I mean, to follow up on that, sir -- would it be fair to say that family considerations at this point, at least, are the only thing that would keep you from running?

PAUL: They're a major component of the discussion, and -- but a lot of things enter into it, you know. So, we'll see what happens over the next year. But I really am going to keep doing the things I am doing and trying to help fight for jobs in Kentucky as well as across America. And I'll just keep doing the things that I want to do and I think the people of Kentucky elected me to do. And I'm just am not ready to make a decision yet.

WALLACE: Senator Paul, thank you. Thanks for joining us. It's always a pleasure to talk with you, sir.

PAUL: Thanks, sir.

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