MSNBC "The Ed Show" - Transcript

Interview

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REP. DENNIS KUCINICH (D), OHIO: Thank you very much, Ed. It"s great to be with you.

SCHULTZ: You bet.

How serious do you think Issa is? And should this be a wake-up call to the country.

KUCINICH: Well, as you point out, this is the committee that has the ability to be able to investigate anything, and to compel witnesses to come by virtue of subpoenas, to compel the production of documents. If an individual is chairing that committee who has no compunction about making unsubstantiated charges or using smears and innuendo, what that can do, it can plunge the entire oversight responsibilities in the United States Congress into suspicion, into a lack of public confidence.

I"m concerned about the institution of Congress here. I"m concerned that the Oversight Committee not be used to smear people, to engage in witch hunts.

And so I came forward after hearing my friend, Mr. Issa, a week ago make the comments that spoke about the "widespread corruption inside the administration," and basically said, look, put up. What do you have? Come forward.

But don"t conclude with a charge unless you have the evidence. That"s not the American way.

In America, you don"t smear people when you"re trying to get to the truth. You hold hearings. You bring forth the evidence. You come to conclusions.

So, I think, Ed, that we have to have zero tolerance for smears and innuendo, immediate response to any unsubstantiated charges, and a firm commitment to the process of oversight which gives people a chance to testify without charging them with anything.

SCHULTZ: Congressman, do you want to be the ranking member?

KUCINICH: Well, I"m going to be talking to my colleagues about what would be the best route to take to ensure that the oversight responsibilities of the Congress will, in fact, not be compromised by a mentality of a star chamber. And so this is inside baseball, effectively, Ed. Members have to make the decision about who they think would be best ready to be able to take this challenge.

SCHULTZ: But do you think--

KUCINICH: Because it is a challenge.

SCHULTZ: -- it will take a special effort to thwart Issa?

KUCINICH: Well, listen, he"s a very clever man. He"s quite skillful.

He is someone who is formidable, should not be underestimated.

And I think, yes, it is going to take a concerted and special effort to be able to meet the chapter and verse allegations that are already floating out there. When you say that the president of the United States is corrupt, you better have some facts before you say that.

And when you"re chairman of an investigative committee, you could--you may conclude that after a body of evidence. But if you say that without having the evidence to prove it, what you"re doing is you"re undermining public confidence in government and you"re assaulting the presidency of the United States, which isn"t about one man. It"s about our nation.

And we have to be very certain that in this oversight, that we don"t let it run on to smears where people have their reputations damaged, and then somebody comes back later on and says, oh, you know what? I guess that we didn"t find anything. You know, first you get the evidence.

SCHULTZ: Congressman, I think you should be the ranking member on this committee. You have the working knowledge. You have the passion, the desire. And you know how serious this guy is. I mean, this is going to be a full-time job, big-time, watching these people, because I think that their mission is to take down this president.

Congressman--

KUCINICH: Well, it is.

SCHULTZ: -- good to have you with us tonight.

KUCINICH: And we have to stay on top of this. And I"ll keep you posted, Ed. I"m talking to my colleagues next.

SCHULTZ: OK. Thank you so much.

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