CNN The Situation Room-Transcript

CNN The Situation Room-Transcript

BLITZER: The shock of November's elections may be wearing off, but some conservatives are already having bad dreams about 2008. Those dreams involve a Hillary Rodham Clinton presidency.

One key Republican left Capitol Hill as some sort of scandal took over, and, as a result, he is here with us.

That would be the former House Majority Leader Tom DeLay.

Thanks very much for coming in.

TOM DELAY (R), FORMER HOUSE MAJORITY LEADER: My pleasure, Wolf.

BLITZER: Appreciate it very much.

Hillary Clinton -- you fear she may, may be unbeatable right now, is that right?

DELAY: Absolutely.

BLITZER: Why?

DELAY: Well, if you -- if you study the opposition, as I do, you know that the -- those that worked in the Clinton White House didn't just go away. When they left the White House in 2001, they went to work and they've built the biggest, most powerful coalition that I've ever witnessed in my lifetime.

And they used that coalition in the last election. And that coalition is available to Hillary. A lot of money, a lot of coordination, coalitions of different groups working together, very well coordinated, a lot of good strategy.

BLITZER: Some...

DELAY: (UNINTELLIGIBLE) from the right.

BLITZER: Some talented staff who have been through it...

DELAY: That's right. That's right.

BLITZER: ... getting a president elected on two earlier occasions.

DELAY: That's right.

BLITZER: You're quoted as saying this in thepolitico.com: "If the conservative movement and Republicans don't understand how massive the Clinton coalition is, Hillary Clinton will be the next president.

DELAY: That's correct.

BLITZER: All right, so what do you think your fellow conservatives in the GOP need to do to stop Senator Clinton?

DELAY: Well, first and foremost, they need to go back and show their base that they haven't lost their principle, they haven't lost their way, that they will fight for what they believe in. That will energize the base.

Obviously, Hillary being nominated will energize the base. And, at the same time, they have to build and bring people together to fight for what they believe in.

BLITZER: Who in the Republican that can generate, that can mobilize that force best?

We've seen in the polls the two frontrunners are John McCain and Rudy Giuliani.

Can they do it?

DELAY: Well, I don't know. We're going to have to wait and see.

BLITZER: You know both of these men.

what do you think of them?

DELAY: The party is crying for leadership.

BLITZER: Do these -- is one of these two guys, the leader the party is crying for?

DELAY: Well, certainly -- certainly Giuliani is a leader. He's already demonstrated that. And I've also seen that he's sort of got the Ronald Reagan syndrome, that if you are a leader and people perceive you as a leader, they will forgive you of some of the things that they may disagree with you about.

BLITZER: On some of the social issues like...

DELAY: Exactly.

BLITZER: ... gay rights or abortion rights.

DELAY: Exactly.

BLITZER: Or gun control?

DELAY: I won't. I won't.

BLITZER: You could...

DELAY: I want...

BLITZER: Could you see yourself supporting Rudy Giuliani if he becomes the Republican nominee?

DELAY: I can't vote for somebody that's for abortion. I just -- I never have and I never will.

BLITZER: So you could never forgive him on that, even though he says I abhor, I hate abortion, but he believes in a woman's right to have an abortion?

DELAY: Well, he and I disagree fundamentally -- and that's fundamental with me.

BLITZER: And that issue is overarching, as far as you're concerned?

DELAY: Absolutely.

BLITZER: What about other social conservatives or conservatives in the GOP? Could he overcome that hurdle with them, because you like his stance, presumably, on fighting terrorists and the war in Iraq?

DELAY: Well, I don't like his gun control. I don't like his approach to gay marriage.

BLITZER: He says he opposes gay marriage, although he supports gay rights.

DELAY: Now he does. He didn't just a year ago. So -- but, he shows leadership and others -- I mean I'm not the majority, although I think half of our party votes for someone that's pro-life and will not vote for someone that's not.

BLITZER: So you think it's unlikely he could get the Republican nomination?

DELAY: I don't know. I think it's way too early. It's also a situation of if not Giuliani, then who?

BLITZER: Well, I heard...

DELAY: As compared to what?

BLITZER: I heard you say that Giuliani is a leader, even though you disagree with him on several of these social issues.

What about John McCain?

I didn't hear you say he was a leader.

DELAY: Well, John McCain certainly is -- is leading right now in our -- in our primary. I don't think he'll get very far because he is not -- does not reflect the vast majority of the party.

BLITZER: On what issue?

DELAY: On many issues. You name it. He also -- there's a lot of conservatives that fault him for our situation right now...

BLITZER: Well, give us...

DELAY: ... because of McCain-Feingold. And...

BLITZER: The campaign financing...

DELAY: Yes. The lack of understanding of what the constitution guarantees and what rights it guarantees.

BLITZER: So is it just that or is there something else you don't like about him?

DELAY: No. I just -- it's not that I don't like it about him...

BLITZER: No, no, no, he's...

DELAY: (UNINTELLIGIBLE)...

BLITZER: ... on the issues. On the issues.

DELAY: Well, there's a lot of them that are running and it's way too early, particularly on our side. I don't think it's too early on the Democrats' side.

BLITZER: It's a wide open race right now.

DELAY: It's wide open.

BLITZER: Who do you like? Who's -- who do you feel comfortable with, that they can fit the description of being a leader and also you feel comfortable with on the issues?

DELAY: Well, Mitt Romney is a leader. But I want to make sure that what he now says he believes is fundamental to his world view.

BLITZER: Because he's accused of flip-flopping.

DELAY: Exactly. I want to see -- I want to see action, not words. I want -- I like -- Governor Mike Huckabee is my favorite. I've known him for 20 years. I know what kind of man he is. He's an incredible leader and was a great governor in Arkansas. And his world view is almost identical to mine.

BLITZER: So you like -- would you think that -- because there's been a lot of buzz about Newt Gingrich, the former speaker, the man you worked with for many years.

Do you think, A, he will get into this race; and, B, if he does, could he get the Republican nomination?

DELAY: I think he could get the Republican nomination. I think Newt is a brilliant man. His speaking ability is so far above and beyond anybody else's. He can stimulate a crowd of people to march out of that room and fight the battles in the streets. And he has that great gift of ideas.

So...

BLITZER: Would you like him to run?

DELAY: I like all of them. I...

BLITZER: You like some more than others?

DELAY: Some more than others. You know, it's sort of -- it's got a -- it's going to be damned if you and damned if you don't. If Hillary actually becomes president of the United States, it may be the best thing that ever happened to the Republican Party.

BLITZER: Explain that.

DELAY: Well, it was the best thing that ever happened to the Republican Party that Bill Clinton was president of the United States. We were able to get the majority and hold onto it for many, many years. Part of that was Hillary, particularly in...

BLITZER: With her health care plan?

DELAY: With her health care plan. And their disdain for the military and homosexuals and a whole lot of other issues that showed that they were way too far to the left...

BLITZER: One final...

DELAY: For the American people.

BLITZER: One final question, Congressman, before I let you go.

How much blame do you put on the president right now -- his policies, his stance over the last six years -- for the predicament the Republican Party has?

DELAY: Oh, I don't blame the president at all. I think circumstances presented themselves. We did sort of lose our way and we were -- we were not being able to communicate what we've done -- what we were doing to the American people. Things started breaking down.

But more important than all of that, the Democrats were ready for this situation. And with that coalition that they put together, they were able to win an election with no vision, no ideas, no agency -- and they even hid their leaders for the month before the election.

BLITZER: A grudging admiration for the Democrats from Tom DeLay.

DELAY: Yes.

BLITZER: Thanks very much, Congressman, for coming in.

DELAY: My pleasure, Wolf.

BLITZER: Appreciate it.

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