State of the Union: Interview With Sen. Sherrod Brown (D- OH)

Interview

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Well, they're right to be skeptical.

The EPA administrator, when I was there -- both the state and the federal EPA administrators said that, but -- when you return to your home, we think the water is safe, but, when you return to your home, you should be tested again for your water and your soil and your air, not to mention those that have their own wells.

So, this is -- Pamela this is really the same old story. Corporations do stock buybacks, they do big dividend checks, they lay off workers. Thousands of workers have been laid off from Norfolk Southern. Then they don't invest in safety rules and safety regulation, and this kind of thing happens.

That's why people in East Palestine are so upset. They know they have -- they know that corporate lobbyists have had far too much influence in our government. And they see this as the result. And this kind of thing shouldn't happen. There was also a Norfolk Southern derailment in Sandusky on Lake Erie in Ohio. There was one just a few days ago in Detroit.

These things are happening because the -- these -- the railroads are simply not investing the way they showed in car safety and in the rail lines themselves.

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Well, I think they are. I mean, I talked to the mayor. The mayor said definitively, emphatically, that people can drink the water. The mayor's -- I don't know. I don't think the mayor has small kids. He looks a little older to me. I didn't ask him, but -- about bathing his kids.

But he would -- he has said he would drink this water.

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Well, I think he probably is. Yes, I think he probably is. But I do think, though, as I said, when you hear all this stuff about stock buybacks, and they're underinvesting, as you say, in rail safety, the tracks themselves and the cars, but when it really hits you is, I was at the home of Kristina Ferguson. I spoke at length to fire -- the fire chief, Chief Drabick. I then was at the home of Kristina Ferguson, who invited us in.

She fled her home. And then she came back to meet us there, but she's not living back there. She's skeptical, as she has a right to be. But the pain and anguish in her face -- she lives with a -- her mother-in- law lives with her, who has -- who is ill, and she's not ready to go back.

And you think about just the whole idea of you had to flee your home because of something -- because a railroad failed to do its job, as the executives and their lobbyists get richer and richer and richer. And there's something very wrong with that.

But when you see the faces of the fire chief and the face of Ms. Ferguson, it really strikes you that we have got a lot to do to fix this to make rail safer, to fight against lobbyists who keep trying to weaken these rules, as they did three or four years ago. That's our mission. That's our job.

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Well, they have made promises to me.

I have spoken to their executives. They made promises to the community. The first thing I say is, if they write a check to an East Palestine or Unity Township resident or people even a little farther away, never sign away your legal rights. You can accept the check, but don't sign anything that would sign away your legal rights. That's what companies like this do.

They have made promises. My job -- and I talked to a Republican congressman, Bill Johnson. I was there with him. We are working together on this to make sure that Norfolk Southern lives up to everything it needs to do. It's way more than a $1,000 check per person. It's -- the fire station is 20 feet from a rail line.

What would have happened if that train passed that fire station, if that had blown up, then derailed then? The whole fire station would have been enveloped with -- by fire and by chemicals and all that, so -- and residents, just the time away from their homes, the hotel bills, all those things. But Norfolk Southern has made commitments. We're going to make sure they live up to those commitments.

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Well, the commitments is the -- yes, sure.

I mean, the commitments they have told me is essentially making everybody whole. And that is all the cleanup, all the help for residents. It's going to be -- I don't know billions, like you suggested. It's going to be tens of millions, maybe hundreds of millions of dollars in that community of 4,500 people and then the township, Unity Township, a little larger.

But they will -- whatever they need -- everything that's happened here, all the cleanup, all the drilling, all the testing, all the hotel stays, all of that is on Norfolk Southern. They caused it. There's no question they caused it with this derailment, because, again, they underinvested in their employees by laying -- there - my understanding, there are only three full-time people on that 50 -- it might have been more than 50-car train that went through town, because they have laid off so many people.

And, I mean, that's why I'm angry, when I look at these companies lay people off. They never look out for their workers. They never look out for their communities. They look out for stock buybacks and dividends. Something's wrong with corporate America and something's wrong with Congress and administrations listening too much to corporate lobbyists.

And that's got to change.

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I mean, that's the fight I make.

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OK.

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Well, I know this, that, three or four years ago, the -- every time there's a new administration, particularly a more conservative one that's more pro-corporate, they put all these regulations on the table about safety, about worker safety, community safety, the environment, consumer protections, and, at the behest of lobbyists, far too often, they weaken those laws.

That happened three, four, five years ago. I have urged President Biden by phone yesterday, I have urged Secretary Buttigieg by phone yesterday to make sure that they look at all these rules and restrengthen them. Part of it's on Congress. Congress has got to do its job better.

But it's -- there's simply, Pam, as you know -- Pamela, there's simply too much influenced by corporate lobbyists in Washington. And it's terrible in Republican administrations. It's not all that great in Democratic administration sometimes.

So, that's my job, to push the administration and to move in Congress on one more pro-consumer, pro-worker, pro-environment laws and pro- community safety laws to make sure these things don't happen.

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Always. Thank you.

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