MSNBC "All In with Chris Hayes" - Transcript: Interview with Adam Schiff

Interview

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

HAYES: So, perhaps it come as no surprise yesterday when the chair of the committee, Democratic Congressman Bennie Thompson of Mississippi said that we "Will probably as a committee issue subpoenas either to witnesses or organizations within a week. This comes as Politico is reporting today the committee member, Democratic Congressman Adam Schiff of California, has admitted to a more aggressive approach when it comes to issuing those subpoenas, saying that the committee is going to forego some of the time- consuming steps that have dogged previous investigations.

When it comes to shoring up what Schiff has called fault lines in America`s democracy, he did not stop there. Separate from the work of the committee, Congressman Schiff introduced a bill today, along with other members of Congress that aims to set new limits on presidential power.

And Congressman Adam Schiff joins me now. Congressman, first tell me what this bill would do and why it`s necessary in the wake of what we`ve experienced.

REP. ADAM SCHIFF (D-CA): Well, this bill is really modeled after what Congress did post-Watergate when they enact enacted a whole series of reforms designed to address the abuses that took place during the Nixon administration. This current package of reforms, enforces and expedites congressional subpoenas so that we can`t have a new administration essentially tie us up in court for year after year after year.

[20:25:16]

It strengthens penalties for violating the Hatch Act so that the White House can`t hold a political convention on White House grounds or dragoon federal employees into campaign workers. It protects against the abuse of the party from power. It tolls the statute of limitations for presidents who commit crimes so they can`t simply avoid prosecution because they`re in office and escape prosecution after they leave because the statute of limitations expires.

It protects inspector generals that protects whistleblowers. It strengthens the independence of the Justice Department. And, Chris, that`s just a partial list.

HAYES: Well, it seems to me that you can imagine a world in which this would be bipartisan insofar as like on congressional subpoenas, right? I mean, you know, there`s a partisan interest here, and then there`s a -- there`s a different branches of government interest. You know, much of what Trump did, one could say, has rendered congressional subpoenas particularly executive, pretty empty. I imagine Republicans are going to want to use that power again. But I think I know my answer the question, but do you have Republicans interested in this as well?

SCHIFF: Well, Chris, I hope that we will. You know, of course, they live in fear. So many of them live in fear of an errant statement of the former president criticizing them for supporting pro-democracy efforts if it`s viewed as a criticism of his conduct of office. So, we got to get over that fear factor in terms of the Republicans.

But many of the reforms, the individual reforms in this bill had Republican support in the past. Heck, I mean, some of the Republicans were leaders of efforts to protect inspector generals and whistleblowers. Some Republicans introduced legislation in the past to expedite enforcement of congressional subpoenas.

And I would hope that they would recognize, look, these are things that they should want, no matter who the President of the United States is. They ought to be defending their own institution. If we can`t do oversight, we can`t be effective.

HAYES: I want to play for you something I just said on that question which is the Secretary of State of Georgia, I asked him about compliance and cooperation with the January 6 committee. This is what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOHN EASTMAN, THE FEDERALIST SOCIETY: The vice president in the meeting I had in the Oval Office with him and the President on January 4th specifically asked me, do you think I have the authority to simply unilaterally decide that certain of these electoral votes are invalid? And I said, that`s an open question. This is a direct quote. But whether or not you have that authority, the fact that the legislatures have not certified the alternate slate of electors would make it foolish to exercise it.

And that`s why at the end of the day, what we were asking is simply that he accede to requests from a number of the state legislatures -- legislators to delay things so that they were now coming back into formal session. Their governors refused to call them into special session to deal with this. They were now back into normal session and they wanted to look at it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HAYES: That was obviously not the Secretary of State of Georgia. That was the Conservative lawyer John Eastman who has been advising the former President about essentially how to get Mike Pence to overturn the election unilaterally through a very torture reading of his constitutional duties.

It seems to me to relate to the project that you`re engaged in insofar as the ultimate power is using the power of the office to stay in office, which is what was contemplated here and what it seems to me there needs to be a firewall against.

SCHIFF: Well, absolutely. And whether it was the right clip or not, both are very pertinent to what we`re doing on the January 6 select committee. We`re going to be making a series of recommendations on how to protect our democracy going forward from efforts like the one that you just heard described where they would flout the spirit of the law and put our country into a constitutional crisis by trying to overturn the clear election results of their will of the voters.

So, we`ll be addressing that on the January 6 Select Committee. In terms of what the Georgia Secretary of State said, and I did hear that where he talked about how he might cooperate with the select committee now that we have Republican staff as well as Democratic staff. Look, our committee is bipartisan. Our members are bipartisan, our staff is bipartisan, and our work is nonpartisan.

But -- and there`s no reason that the Secretary should not cooperate with us. I think he`s got an important story to tell the American people. But I will say this, you don`t get to pick and decide, I like this committee, I don`t like this committee, I like this composition or I don`t. When you get a congressional subpoena, you have to comply with it. When you get a request for information, we would hope we would do so voluntarily.

HAYES: Yes, I guess that`s the question, right? I mean, what is the lesson you`ve learned from the -- I mean, you`ve got a sort of statutory fix here in the legislation you propose today that would strengthen congressional subpoenas. But what`s the lesson you`ve learned about tactics or approach with those document requests and subpoenas from all the stonewalling that in some ways ended up being partially successful from the Trump folks?

[20:30:14]

SCHIFF: Well, it was all too successful. And you know, except for the fact that we impeach the president over his obstruction of Congress. But the lesson we learned is that number one, we need statutory changes to expedite enforcement so another president can`t simply play rope-a-dope in the courts.

In the interim, in the meanwhile, we do have a mechanism we didn`t have over the last four years, which is someone who flouts our subpoenas we can hold in contempt and make a referral to the Justice Department, and it won`t be ignored by a Bill Barr crony of the President. So, people who do flout our subpoenas will understand that they could face criminal exposure if they do so. And that`s not a worry that I think any of the Trump people have.

HAYES: All right, Congressman Adam Schiff, thanks for making time tonight.

SCHIFF: Thank you.

BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT

Source