CNN "Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees" - Transcript: Interview with Bernie Sanders

Interview

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COOPER: All right, John King, thanks very much. We will check in with you a lot.

More perspective now from Senator Bernie Sanders, who urged California to support Governor Newsom in a recent anti-recall ad. Senator Sanders, thanks for joining us. So, you heard John King, many Democrats optimistic tonight about Governor Newsom's chances to fend off this recall. Do you share that optimism?

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (I-VT): Well, I am not much into political speculation, we will find out the results of that election in a few hours. But I think Governor Newsom has done a good job under very difficult circumstances, and I think what you're seeing in California, and all over this country is a lot of anger and frustration.

You know, we're dealing with COVID. We're dealing with economic problems. We're dealing with climate change. But I think in California, the Governor has done his best, done well, and I think the people will respond accordingly.

COOPER: It also seems that Governor Newsom sort of made the decision to try to nationalize the race, to talk about the big lie, about Trumpism, and I'm wondering if you think that was a wise thing to do?

SANDERS: Yes, I do. I mean, I think the truth is that California does not need a right-wing Governor -- Republican Governor. I think it is historically been in recent years, one of the most progressive states in the United States and I think the people want it to stay that way.

COOPER: Larry Elder and the former President have already made it clear that if Governor Newsom holds on to his job, they're going to say the election was rigged. I mean, is this now going to happen in every race where a Republican wins.

SANDERS: Well, it may. And this is one of the crises that we face right now. Which is why, by the way, I'm working so hard as the Chairman of the Senate Budget Committee on this reconciliation bill.

I think a lot of people in America are losing faith in government. When you have Republicans saying that every election that took place that they lose was rigged, then people are not going to believe very much about the political process. And what we are trying to do right now, in the United States Senate, in the house is pass the most consequential piece of legislation in the modern history of this country, which tells the working families of California and Vermont and all over this country, that maybe, just maybe the time is now for Congress to address the crises that is facing working families, and not continue to just worry about the needs of the wealthy and the powerful.

So I've been focusing on that issue, and we look forward to getting it passed in the near future.

COOPER: Yes, just to remind viewers, you are Chairman of the Budget Committee. I mean, there is a struggle within your own party, obviously, to present a united front on the $3.5 trillion budget reconciliation package that you support. Senator Manchin told Dana Bash on Sunday that there is no way he would vote for anything close to that. He indicated maybe he would support a $1.5 trillion package.

His vote obviously is incredibly important in terms of passing. Is there a solution here? Is that just a negotiation tactic?

SANDERS: Yes, there is a solution. Look, I mean, I think we negotiating -- we're negotiating with 50 people. Everybody in the caucus has their needs and has their concerns. But this is what I think every member of the Democratic Caucus understands and that is we live in a country where the people on top are doing phenomenally well, while working families are struggling.

Does anyone deny that our childcare system is a dysfunctional mess? No. People are paying $10,000.00, $15,000.00 or $20,000.00 a year for childcare. We have a million women who would like to return to the workforce, but can't because they can't find adequate child care. We have to deal with child care.

Does anybody deny that our higher educational system is unaffordable? I don't think so. We need to make sure that our young people get the training that they need, get the college credits they need in a way they can afford it. That's why we're trying to make two years of community colleges tuition free. I would go further than that. That's a start.

Does anybody in America think it's appropriate that we got elderly people who have no teeth in their mouth, that can't afford hearing aids, they can't afford eyeglasses, that's why we're trying to expand Medicare to cover those issues -- and on top of all of that, I hope there are very few people in America who do not understand that we are facing a massive crisis in terms of climate change.

And that if we do not begin the process of transforming our energy system away from fossil fuel, the planet, the country that we're going to be leaving our children and grandchildren are increasing -- will be increasingly unhealthy and uninhabitable.

Among many other issues we did -- what we are trying to do, Anderson, which is unprecedented, what the President is doing is taking a look at the crises facing America and saying you know what, whether it's high cost of prescription drugs, healthcare, whatever it is, we are going to address those crises rather than give more tax breaks to the rich and the powerful.

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COOPER: So, how will the final figure be decided? I mean, where --

SANDERS: It's going to be $3.5 trillion dollars. That's the compromise that's already been made. I think what we perceive right now. I mean, you should stick around me for a day. You hear all these folks coming at me, "Bernie, I need to do more on childcare. We need to do more on pre-K. We need to do more on affordable housing. We need to do more."

The truth is $3.5 trillion is not enough. And I will tell you this, that over the next 10 years, when you look at the gross domestic product of the United States, we're talking about close to $300 trillion over the next 10 years. This is $3.5 trillion, barely more than one percent of that.

And furthermore, it is -- if I have anything to say about it, this legislation, $3.5 trillion will be paid for, will not add to the national debt. And it'll be paid for by finally demanding that the wealthiest people in this country when some would pay zero, they pay less than the average fire person or teacher, pay zero in Federal taxes. Large corporations pay nothing in Federal taxes. We're going to change that. So it will be paid for.

COOPER: So $3.5 trillion for you, that's there -- it can't go lower than that.

SANDERS: No. And in fact, as you know, we compromised already. Most of the members of the caucus wanted $6 trillion, which is a more appropriate number.

COOPER: Senator Sanders, I appreciate you joining us. Thank you.

SANDERS: Thank you.

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