CNN "The Lead with Jake Tapper" - Transcript Interview with Chris Van Hollen

Interview

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And joining me now is Democratic Senator Chris Van Hollen of Maryland.

Nice to see you, Senator.

I want to go off what Kaitlan just said, that, look, the White House says, the president says he is using the tax code in a way every American can.

Your response?

SEN. CHRIS VAN HOLLEN (D-MD): Well, Pamela, it's good to be with you.

And, of course, we don't know the answer to that question, because the president refuses to disclose his taxes, like every other presidential candidate has done since Ronald Reagan.

As you just reported, the president can do that. He claims he's not because of an audit, but that's just a smokescreen. And so, if you look at what "The New York Times" has reported, like that $70,000 deduction for hairstyling,I mean, that's just one of many examples that suggests the president played fast and loose with the IRS code.

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And this is, again, why he's so determined to hide this from the American people.

BROWN: So, you say the president -- it's an example of the president playing fast and loose with the IRS code.

But there is a difference between illegally evading taxes and taking advantage of the tax code. Do you see anything that's actually illegal in the reporting?

VAN HOLLEN: Well, I have been listening to all the analysts, and looking into the reports, and there do seem to be some sketchy things as to what the president has claimed as deductions.

We also see these transfers of money to people like other family members, where they took a business deduction.

So, look, there's lots of sketchy stuff. But this certainly undermines the president's whole narrative that he was a successful businessman, because he can't have it both ways. Either he took huge losses on his businesses, despite all his puffery, or he's playing fast and loose, and possibly very illegally, with the tax code.

You really can't have it both ways. And so I think this is going to show the American people what a disconnect there is between the president's rhetoric about how he's looking out for everyday Americans and what he's doing himself.

After all--

(CROSSTALK)

BROWN: So, do you think this will move the needle for Americans who are right now in the midst of voting, and, of course, the election right around the corner? You think that this will move the needle?

VAN HOLLEN: Well, I do think this can have an impact. I think this can hurt the president, because he goes out of his way to pretend that he's the guy that's looking after everybody else, when, in fact, he's paying $750 per year, taking $70,000 deductions for hairstyling, while the typical American family earning $60,000 is paying more taxes than Donald Trump.

And teachers who use their own money to buy books for their kids are capped at an annual deduction of $250. So, for a president who pretends to be looking out for the little guy, all this shows how disconnected he really is.

BROWN: But it is the problem here President Trump, or the problem the tax code that allows the wealthy to take advantage of the system?

VAN HOLLEN: Well, there's no doubt that, if he did this in a legal manner, there are huge problems with the tax code. And many of us have been trying to plug those loopholes for many, many years.

The president, of course, in his 2017 tax proposal, opened up even more loopholes for folks who do real estate deals and so many others, people who want to hide their assets overseas.

And, as we learned, the president is paying foreign governments some more taxes than he's paying to the U.S. government and the American people.

But, absolutely, we need to be closing these big loopholes in the tax code. The president has done nothing to do that, despite what he said in the 2016--

(CROSSTALK)

BROWN: But do you blame the president for taking care -- taking advantage of some of these loopholes that you're pointing out?

VAN HOLLEN: Well, again, we don't know to what extent he was taking advantage of them legally and to what extent he was skirting the law.

That's why it's so important to see--

(CROSSTALK) BROWN: To get more information. And, clearly, you're not going to let up on that.

I just really want to ask you quickly, the president has, as we know, nominated Amy Coney Barrett to the Supreme Court. You have said you will -- quote -- "use every legal tool available to stop the abuse of power."

How can you do that, at the end of the day, when the Constitution allows the president to do what he did?

VAN HOLLEN: Well, there are a couple things here.

One, of course, is the precedent that was established by Mitch McConnell himself in 2016. And now he wants to apply one set of rules to Democratic presidents, like Barack Obama, and different ones to Donald Trump.

But we will use all the rules at our disposal to try to block this nomination. I would also point out that, in 2017, when everybody thought that the Republicans would succeed in their legislative effort to overturn the Affordable Care Act, the American public rallied, and they helped us defeat that effort by one vote.

People thought that it would go through, their effort to undo it. But, in the end, it didn't. We have two Republican senators so far. We need two more. And it is absolutely the case that the future the Affordable Care Act and protections for people with preexisting conditions is what this vote is all about, together with protecting women's reproductive rights, workers' rights, and so much else.

BROWN: All right, Democratic Senator Chris Van Hollen of Maryland, thank you for coming on.

VAN HOLLEN: Pamela, good to be with you.

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