Hearing of the Senate Armed Services Committee - Afghanistan

Hearing

SEN. WARNER: Thank you very much, Senator. Senator Pryor.

SEN. PRYOR: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. I have just a couple of quick questions about al Qaeda. And, Director Tenet, I would like to direct those at you if possible.

First is a follow-up on Senator Bayh's very good questioning about al Qaeda and their capabilities and the manpower that they have. And you mention that there were -- there are two facts. One is that we have disabled, if I can use that term, a lot of their leadership, and also secondly that they also trained potentially thousands of troops, if you can call them that, or thousands of foot soldiers or believers, whatever you want to say, in Afghanistan and other places around the world. Is al Qaeda at the present time growing?

MR. TENET: I think that the most important point I would make is because you've taken the sanctuary away, and the ability to train in unlimited capability, and unlimited resource with impunity, you have hurt the ability of the organization to grow -- there is no doubt about that -- to train and deploy people. Whether people are motivated by the message and, you know, are comfortable with them, or it's a different category. But I would say once you took the sanctuary away and you put them on the run and you made them be at greater risk, you have jeopardized their ability to grow with trained operatives.

SEN. PRYOR: Do they have a new sanctuary?

MR. TENET: A new sanctuary? Nothing that rivals what we once saw in Afghanistan -- nothing. What we are trying to do is find where they may migrate to in the same kind of mass and scope.

SEN. PRYOR: And is it your perception that as some leadership is removed from the picture other leadership is developing?

MR. TENET: Well, that's in -- I'd like to talk about that in closed session.

SEN. PRYOR: And the last thing I have on al Qaeda is, you know, we hear a lot about it -- for years really, but certainly after September 11th. There's not an American today that doesn't know a little something about it. And I assume that in your view it would be categorized as the most dangerous terrorist organization with regard to America's national security.

MR. TENET: They are the most dangerous terrorist organization that has attacked the United States. But I'll tell you that Hezbollah, as an organization with capability and worldwide presence, is its equal, if not a far more capable organization, if you can believe that. It is a very capable organization. So we've got --

SEN. PRYOR: That actually was my question: Is what is number two? Or what would be --

MR. TENET: Well, I'd actually put Hezbollah -- you know, I actually think they are a notch above in many respects in terms of in their relationship with the Iranians and the training they've received puts them in a state-sponsor-supported category with a potential for lethality that's quite great.

SEN. PRYOR: Do they have or are they -- I assume they're organized a little differently than al Qaeda, but it sounds like they're also kind of a loose-knit organization out there. And do they have a safe haven?B. JACOBY: Actually Hezbollah is much tighter, much more structured, much more organized --

SEN. PRYOR: Have more command and control?B. JACOBY: Yes, sir, I would say in sort of a traditional sense, whereas al Qaeda is more of a loose network. And I might add that one of the things in your first question about numbers -- we certainly learned in the U.S.S. Cole attack that there are a few al Qaeda operatives there that ran the operation, but they drew from this larger group of mujaheddin who they had fought with previously, who are not sworn to al Qaeda --

SEN. PRYOR: Right.B. JACOBY: -- did not have allegiance. But when we get into a discussion about relative numbers, back to what the director was saying, the training camps are gone, but the people who would share beliefs and join up for a specific operation are yet another aspect of this whole problem.

SEN. PRYOR: Does Hezbollah have a primary training facility or training region, or a safe haven as we talked about before?

MR. TENET: Southern Lebanon is a place of great concern, obviously, sir, where they have massed.

SEN. PRYOR: Okay, thank you.

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