CNN "The Situation Room" - Transcript: Interview With Rep. Jackie Speier (D-CA)
Interview
BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT
Joining us now, Democratic Congresswoman Jackie Speier, a member of both the Intelligence and Oversight committees, who took part in the impeachment hearings.
Congresswoman, thanks so much for joining us.
Are you satisfied with the Democrats, the leadership's decision to move forward with these two articles of impeachment, abuse of power and obstruction of Congress, while not including allegations from the Mueller report?
REP. JACKIE SPEIER (D-CA): I absolutely am supportive of this effort.
I thought that reaching into the Mueller report would be more complicated and make for a less effective effort to make our case. This is wholly focused on the phone call by President Trump to the president of Ukraine on July 25 and all the machinations and efforts that happened afterwards to withhold aid, to withhold a meeting in the White House.
Ironically, you mentioned that that Foreign Minister Lavrov has now been to the White House for a second time with a meeting with the president. And President Zelensky, our ally, not our adversary, our ally, has yet to have that meeting in the White House.
BLITZER: They did have a meeting in New York, when they were both there for the United Nations. But you're right. He has not been invited yet to the Oval Office, as Lavrov was once again today.
Your -- the Judiciary Committee chairman, Jerry Nadler, privately, we're told, advocated for a third article on obstruction of justice. Why do you think that was ultimately decided against?
SPEIER: I think it was very important to keep it simple and focus on the crime that is before us.
None of this would have happened but for the fact that a whistle- blower came forward, that the president attempted through his staff to hide the summary of that phone call, and then made the decision, well, I will just admit that I had this phone call, it was a perfect phone call -- except we now have so many people within the administration who came forward during our fact-finding to establish that this was very problematic and, in fact, created this quid pro quo.
And now we have over 500 persons who are constitutional scholars coming forward and saying this is, in fact, an impeachable offense.
BLITZER: The Judiciary Committee will start taking up the articles of impeachment tomorrow night, 7:00 p.m. Eastern.
Can you tell us anything about how the process will then unfold?
SPEIER: The process will be one in which each of the members will have an opportunity to make opening statements. And then they will mark up the articles of impeachment, they will consider amendments, probably being made by the Republicans, probably put down by the Democrats.
And once that process is complete, it will come to the House floor for a vote next week.
BLITZER: So, do you have any idea what day next week that might take place?
SPEIER: No, but it probably -- my sense would be in the middle of the week
BLITZER: In the middle of the week sometime. And then it goes to the Senate.
Does it concern you at all that it's almost certainly not going to pass the two-thirds majority required in the Senate for conviction and removal of the president from office?
SPEIER: I think it's very important that we do our job.
And our job was to do the fact-finding, determine whether or not there was the equivalent of an indictment, that the president should be tried as to whether or not this constituted bribery, if this was, in fact, an abuse of power.
It was Hamilton who in the 65th Federalist Paper talked about the abuse of power being -- doing something that violates the public trust. When you put your personal interests above the American people's interest in trying to get dirt on one of your campaign opponents, that is putting yourself first.
And it creates a potential for our national security to be compromised, because we want to maintain Ukraine as a independent country. And, right now, they have Russia in Donbass attempting to of a sphere of influence in Ukraine, which could create the first attempts in 70 years to create a war in Europe.
[18:15:10]
BLITZER: It certainly looks like all the House Republicans will vote against impeachment.
Do you expect some of the more moderate Democrats, who may be vulnerable politically in districts won by President Trump, for example, do you expect some of them will vote against impeaching the president?
SPEIER: I don't know the answer to that question.
It's really a decision that each and every member has to make independently on their own. This is not kind of issue that you would attempt to twist arms. And the speaker has made it very clear that this is a personal decision, weighed by each member, as to whether or not they believe that the impeachment vote should be one in which they vote in favor of it.
BLITZER: Because some of those more moderate Democrats were actually saying, instead of impeachment, maybe censure, since it's not going to be approved in the full Senate down the road, maybe just go with censure and then move on and avoid a trial in the Senate.
What do you say to that?
SPEIER: Well, actually, I don't support the idea of censure.
This was a high crime and misdemeanor. When it does go to the Senate, many of those people that basically defied the subpoenas by Congress, nine of the members within his administration, and all the documents that were not provided, those could, in fact, be brought into the case, which would, in fact, change the dynamics dramatically.
It's ironic that we have been able to cobble together the evidence based on the private texts of Ambassador Kurt Volker. But for those texts, we would not know virtually any of this.
This has been an effort to stonewall this investigation by the president. It is indeed a cover-up, and it needs to be called out for what it is.
BLITZER: Obstruction of Congress, abuse of power, those are the two articles of impeachment.
Representative Jackie Speier, thanks so much for joining us.
SPEIER: Thank you for having me.
BREAK IN TRANSCRIPT
Source