MSNBC "The Rachel Maddow Show" - Transcript: Interview with Rep. Jackie Speier

Interview

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MADDOW:  Joining us now is Congresswoman Jackie Speier of California.  She is a member of the Oversight Committee, as well as the intelligence committee in the House, where Mr. Cohen will be testifying tomorrow in a closed door hearing. 
 
Congresswoman Speier, I imagine your time is very, very pressured right now.  Thank you for taking time to be with us. 
 
SPEIER:  Thank you, Rachel. 
 
MADDOW:  So, I wanted to ask you about that exchange you had with Michael Cohen.  He talked to another couple of your colleagues today about the president`s lawyers being involved in reviewing and editing his congressional testimony about the Trump Tower Moscow project.  We know he has pled guilty to lying to Congress about that, about the duration of that project, among other things. 
 
Do you feel like you have any further clarity about what happened there and whether anybody else may be implicated in that crime of lying to Congress? 
 
SPEIER:  Well, it would appear if Jay Sekulow and Abbe Lowell doctored up his testimony, I think a case can be made that they conspired with Michael Cohen to lie to Congress, and I really feel that it`s going to be very important for us to get a copy of Michael Cohen`s original statement, which he has agreed to offer to the committee to be able to compare it to what was the statement he made to the intelligence committee after the fact.  Clearly, there was an interest in wanting to prevent any word about this Moscow deal with the public during the campaign. 
 
MADDOW:  Forgive me for accidentally interrupting you.  If you were going to pursue that original statement from Mr. Cohen, he certainly seemed amenable today to try to find that and to hand it over to you.  He also told you that he would be happy to provide the committee with what he described as roughly 100 different voice recordings of different communications that he had taped over the years in terms of his involvement at the Trump Organization and with President Trump. 
 
He also suggested a number of people who could potentially corroborate some of the information that he provided today, specifically, he mentioned frequently other people at the Trump Organization who would be able to corroborate what he was alleging today. 
 
Do you expect what the House Oversight Committee just sort of opened a giant can of worms in terms of all of these different investigative avenues that your committee is now going to be able to follow? 
 
SPEIER:  Well, I do believe that we are going to have to bring in the CFO and probably Donald Trump Jr., because they are linked to the checks.  I also think that what we`re going to probably find out, if going to have to bring in the CFO and probably Donald Trump Jr., because they are linked to the checks.  I also think that what we`re going to probably find out, if we are able to get to the Trump Organization`s tax return is that there was tax evasion, and probably misappropriation, because they probably took a tax deduction on the payments to Michael Cohen as a result of the hush money deal. 
 
So, there is a lot more to look at for sure.  Tax evasion, finance bank fraud, all of those I think are worthy of our review. 
 
MADDOW:  One of the things that it`s been sort of hard to track just as an observer of these things, particularly as one who`s not a lawyer, just trying to form the news on this story is where a congressional investigation, including an aggressive one like the one you`re describing may intersect with or need to yield to or potentially impinge on ongoing criminal investigations that are being pursued by the Justice Department.  Obviously, one of those is the Mueller investigation.  But there is a number of references by Mr. Cohen today to what sounds like he was saying would be ongoing investigations by prosecutors in the Southern District of New York that touch on the president. 
 
Do you feel confident both in your work on the intelligence committee and on oversight that there is a way to -- to deconflict, essentially, to do your work in Congress in a way that doesn`t potentially screw up criminal prosecutions that may be in the works at DOJ? 
 
SPEIER:  Well, that`s always a very important issue that we have to address.  I mean, we cannot be in a situation where we`re compromising a federal criminal investigation.  And certainly on the intelligence committee, we were in contact with the special counsel`s office to make sure that people we were calling in were not objected to by the special counsel. 
 
And I`m certain that we will do the same with the Southern District in New York and the actions that they`re pursuing right now. 
 
MADDOW:  Overall, Congresswoman, heading into this Intelligence Committee hearing tomorrow, which, again, you`re on the Intelligence Committee, and that will be a closed door hearing, heading into that tomorrow, hearing what you heard today, what for you is the most important revelation of what Mr. Cohen has been able to bring to Congress.  Obviously, your Republican colleagues have said that nothing that he said should have any weight that he`s a confessed liar, that he never should have been brought before Congress because he has no credibility.  The Democratic chairman of this committee and oversight and the Democratic chairman in intelligence obviously believe that Cohen had something to offer that could be of worth to Congress. 
 
From your perspective, what do you think is most important that he`s been able to bring forward thus far? 
 
SPEIER:  Well, he has ten years of experience working as the fixer for Donald Trump, in many real estate deals.  And part of our focus on the Intelligence Committee is to drill down ever so carefully into many of these real estate deals that appear to have Russian involvement. 
 
And to the Republicans in the committee who kept saying he`s a liar, it`s important to remind everybody that he was lying on behalf of President Trump.  And he is going to jail.  President Trump is not. 
 
MADDOW:  Congresswoman Jackie Speier of California, Oversight Committee, Intelligence Committee.  Michael Cohen will be testifying there tomorrow.  Really appreciate you being here tonight. 
 
Congresswoman, good luck tomorrow. 
 
SPEIER:  Thank you. 

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