NBC "Meet the Press" - Transcript: Interview with Sen. Mitt Romney
Interview
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CHUCK TODD:
Welcome back. Most Republican office holders have been reluctant, even a bit scared, to criticize President Trump. Not Mitt Romney. Just two days before he took the oath as a new senator from Utah, Mitt Romney wrote this, "Presidential leadership and qualities of character is indispensable. And it is in this province where the incumbent's shortfall has been most glaring." However, like President Trump, Mitt Romney has been sharply critical of Obamacare and he says he's even tougher on illegal immigration than the president. And Mitt Romney joins me now from Salt Lake City in his first Meet the Press appearance as Senator Romney. And in fact, we were just debating. Do you prefer Governor or Senator still?
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
The term Governor's always better, but I guess I've got to go by my current title, which is Senator. --
CHUCK TODD:
That's exactly what we --
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
But Mitt-- but Mitt is just fine, Chuck. Mitt is just fine.
CHUCK TODD:
It's exactly what we all predicted because we've never met a senator who was a former governor who didn't miss being governor. Let me start with what the president said both Friday and Saturday about immigration and the asylum seekers. Here it is, sir.
[BEGIN TAPE]
PRESIDENT TRUMP:
This is our new statement. The system is full can't take you anymore. Whether it's asylum, whether it's anything you want, it's illegal immigration. Can't take you anymore. We can't take you. Our country is full.
[END TAPE]
CHUCK TODD:
It's a little jarring to hear an American president say, "Our country is full," given the history of the United States of America. How did you take that comment?
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
Well, we've seen a dramatic shift in the nature of immigration and illegal immigration just over the last few weeks. I mean, a number of years ago and up until just a few weeks ago, the great majority of people coming into our country were coming, looking for work. Single men and oftentimes just were turned at the border. Sent back home typically to Mexico. In the last few weeks, there's been a dramatic change and that is we're seeing unaccompanied young people, as well as families with lots of kids, pouring into the border. And they say the magic word, "I'm seeking asylum." And by virtue of our laws and processes here, we bring them into the country. We don't begin to have enough space in our facilities to maintain the kind of care that these people deserve. And so they're being just turned out into our country, 125,000 of them so far this year. It's overwhelming our system. We have got to be able to deal with this in a way. It's going to take some legislation to get it fixed.
CHUCK TODD:
Well, and that's what I'm curious about. How would you be handling this? I mean, the president has threatened to impose economic penalties on Mexico, a tariff on cars if they don't help with the border that are shipped to Mex -- Mexico. He's threatened to pull all foreign aid to the three Central American countries where many of these people are fleeing. You know, it's called a carrot and stick approach for a reason. He's only, he's only providing sticks. He doesn't seem to have a carrot here anywhere.
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
Well, I think what has to happen is an effort for Republicans and Democrats to come together, generally with presidential leadership. That's what's going to be essential to get us all--
CHUCK TODD:
But you just said--
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
-- together --
CHUCK TODD:
-- Senator I just heard --
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
-- and say, "Okay, we need to fix --
CHUCK TODD:
-- your hesitation there. Does he have the credibility to do this?
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
Well, he does. He has the capacity to bring together the top Democrats, top Republicans and to sit down and say, "Okay, what can we do legislatively to make sure that we're not creating this extraordinary asylum magnet that's bringing people into the country?" And let me tell you, in my opinion, the Democrats are making a huge error by making border security an issue and saying it's a partisan issue. Look, this is an American issue. We can't have millions upon millions of people flooding into our country without a border that's secure, without ICE making sure the people that are here illegally are sent back. This is, this is a winning issue I think for Republicans. But more importantly, it's a winning issue for Americans to say, "We have to have the sovereignty of our nation." I think the president has tapped into something which the people feel very deeply.
CHUCK TODD:
One of the things that you had said is you'd be tougher on illegal immigration than President Trump. Your positions. What -- Give me an example where you feel as if you're tougher on this than he is.
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
Well, I was referring to a time some years ago when I was running for president and, and noted that I was not in favor of the DREAM Act. And the president supported earlier in 2017 giving the DACA individuals legal residency. So I was referring to that point. But at this stage, I think--
CHUCK TODD:
Are you still against--
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
--we're on the same page.
CHUCK TODD:
--the DREAM Act?
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
Well, it's been put in place by President Obama and I believe we have a responsibility to fulfill what is a presidential pledge and commitment. So that's in the past. I would provide legal status for those Dreamers in the country. That's something the president's put on the table. I think we should get that job done. And hope we will get that job done. But overall, we need to complete the border fence. We need to have a system that keeps people from getting jobs here if they're here illegally, and that's an e-verify system. And then we've got to deal with this asylum issue that's really overwhelming our system.
CHUCK TODD:
Let me move to health care because to me, it's an even more trickier situation, given that you won re-election I believe, excuse me, you won election in Utah on the same ballot that a majority of -- of your constituents wanted to see Medicaid expanded. So what would you do now with health care? Would you scrap the system we have and build from scratch? Or do you take the Obamacare infrastructure, which many will note was modeled in some ways off of what you did in Massachusetts, and try to reform from there?
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
Well, let's begin by putting it in context, which is Obamacare applies to about 20, maybe 25% of the population because for 75 to 80% of the population we get our insurance through our employer or through Medicare or through traditional Medicaid. So Obamacare is just 20, 25% of the population. And right now with Obamacare, that's a federal program. I think what you're going to see from Republicans is a federal-state partnership, where the federal government sets the parameters and the states are given more flexibility to create ways to care for their own low income individuals. And so I think a federal-state partnership is a much wiser way to go. A number of senators are working on those kind of ideas. I know the White House is as well. And I think you're going to see proposals coming from our side that say, "Look, we can make the current system of private insurance, which 75, 80% of Americans have, we can keep that in place, get costs down, more flexibility. And Obamacare needs to be repealed." And by the way, the Democrats agree with us. They agree with us on getting rid of Obamacare because they're calling for Medicare for all.
CHUCK TODD:
Not all Democrats do--
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
Medicare for all wipes out Obamacare.
CHUCK TODD:
No, the irony's not lost. I'm waiting for Republicans to start defending Obamacare as things move on, honestly. I want to ask you though about the Medicaid decision by your constituents. The legislature wants to tighten what your constituents wanted. Is that the right call?
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
Well, the legislature in Utah said, "Look, we want to make sure that if we're going to expand our Medicaid population, we're going to only do so, so long as the federal government is picking up 90% of the bill. But if the federal government decides to back off that 90% number, then we, the state legislature, don't want to pick up the bill." I think it's a reasonable position that the legislature has taken.
CHUCK TODD:
You, you have, you were very aggressive in getting, in getting candidate Donald Trump to try to release his tax returns. He now wants to fight this effort by Congress all the way to the Supreme Court. And while I could maybe understand he wants to do it on privacy grounds, he still doesn't want to show the country his tax returns. How problematic is that?
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
Well, I'd like the president to follow through and show his tax returns. He said he would. I think it was on The Today Show. He said he would be happy to release his returns. So I wish he'd do that. But I have to also tell you I think the Democrats are just playing along his handbook, which is going after his tax returns through a legislative action is moronic. That's not going to happen. The courts are not going to say that you can compel a person running for office to release their tax returns. So he's going to win this victory. He wins them time after time. And, you know, the Green New Deal, all these candidates out there talking about getting, getting rid of Obamacare and traditional health care and putting in place Medicare, these things are just, just nonstarters. And I think the Democratic party is finding itself in a real difficult position with those kind of positions.
CHUCK TODD:
Very quickly, it is coming up to an election year. Jeb Bush, who ran for president in 2016, he said recently that he thinks it would be healthy for the Republican party if somebody challenged Donald Trump to have a real debate about what is conservative anymore. I mean, he's for higher deficits, you were for lower deficits. He's for tariffs, you were not a tariff guy. I mean, one could argue Trump and Romney present the contrast of the two different views of conservatism.
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
Well, there are differences. I have places where I disagree with the president. I was in his office just a couple weeks ago and said I disagreed with the steel and aluminum tariffs. On the other hand, I said, "I'm overwhelmingly in favor with what you're doing on China." In my opinion, you can get as hard as you want to get, pushing back on China. I think you also have to say the president has followed the Republican playbook when it comes to the domestic economy. Lowering taxes, lowering regulation. The economy's doing very, very well. It's hard not to recognize that's a pretty strong record. As to whether or not there's a primary, time will tell. But parties typically do just fine when there's a primary.
CHUCK TODD:
Fair enough. Mitt Romney, now senator from Utah. Though when we see you in the halls of Congress, we'll call you Governor, I promise. Thanks for coming on and sharing your views, sir. Good to see you again.
SEN. MITT ROMNEY:
Thanks Chuck, thank you.
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