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MSNBC "The Ed Show" - Transcript: Debt Ceiling

Interview

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SCHULTZ: Let`s have a debate Hannity. Certainly, you`re punching up in my opinion. I`m joined now by Congressman Bill Pascrell of New Jersey. Congressman, good to have you with us tonight.

REP. BILL PASCRELL, NEW JERSEY: Always going to be here, Ed.

SCHULTZ: The big Trender is Paul Ryan. He is considered the numbers guy and he has been relatively quiet and kind of in the backdrop of all of this. But now, he step forward and he has made some comments when it comes to abortion and what the deal should actually involve. Is he just a holding to these social conservatives?

PASCRELL: Well, yeah. I think he`s looking at 2016 in the presidential race, just like these folks are. They have every right to do that. The problem here is that we`re talking about the debt limit which is going to on effect in a few days and we`re talking about opening up the government.

And of course, they`re going to try every string (ph) to (inaudible) to whatever we`ve ask.

I`m glad that Harry Reid and Mitch McConnell are stepping up to the plate, trying to put a package together, not complicated, something that will take this into 2014 that will be sensible and that we get bipartisan support with.

And, you know what, I feel badly for John Boehner. He`s not a bad person I happen to like him. But John`s missed it. I mean, he let these guys and gals get a way with everything since 2011 and now he`s paying the price, so we had bail him up too.

SCHULTZ: Well, Congressman why would the Democrats agree to something that Mitch McConnell would put his name to after what he has done to President Obama? Why would the Democrats say that all of a sudden Mitch McConnell is an honest broker and give Boehner that opportunity when the public is clearly with the Democrats right now? You have all the cards.

PASCRELL: Republicans clearly with us, but we got to get a resolution of the problem. I think you know that just as well as I do. And either whether it comes from Mitch McConnell and whether it comes from Mr. Boehner, as long as we can do that and not simply talk about saving face, but standing on our principles, the president and he`s supported by the Democrats and both the senate and the house is not going to negotiate the debt deal and he`s not going to negotiate whether we have a budget or not.

We need these things, these are necessities, then we could debate later on we`re not backing off that principle Ed by any stretch in your (ph) imagination.

SCHULTZ: So, what kind of deal we`re talking about here? And what kind of numbers are we talking about?

PASCRELL: We`re talking about a deal that will bring us to January, both on the debt and the continuing resolution which will be in the number which the Republicans have pushed which we compromise on which is the lower deal which includes sequestration between now and then with negotiable parts of that within the next four or five months. That`s something we can begin to live with as long as we can open up this government again and never not agree that sequestration is going to be the name of the game over the next two years.

SCHULTZ: You know, Congressman, this as I see it and I respect your take in a big way. You and I have had some good conversations on a radio over this.

PASCRELL: Yes.

SCHULTZ: If the Democrats do this, this opens the door for a fight on the left because obviously we`re going to be pushing Democrats to hold the line on the Big 3 and not take the cuts in the food stamps, not take the cuts to the social programs, Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security, and this buys the Republicans more time to look like they are negotiators in good faith.

They are not. They want this president out at all cost.

PASCRELL: Yes. I watched those clips from yesterday. They were (ph) an absolute disgrace with the sign in the background and peace to president. He just got elected you fools. You can`t -- you don`t know the time and the date. And thank God you have nothing to do with the negotiations. We`ll need the reasonable people in both parties.And I am telling you, Ed, if we can live with this sequestration for a few
more months, change it because many Republicans do (ph) including Chairman Rogers, he wants to change it. He knows it can`t work when you`re cutting right across the bow (ph) and you`re cutting everything and saying doesn`t make any sense. Well, in order for us to get a deal -- a clean deal, Ed, we may have to swallow something as we did with the number that we`re agreeing on which is less than a trillion dollars.

SCHULTZ: And there`s no time --

PASCRELL: We cut the deficit in half --

SCHULTZ: Absolutely.

PASCRELL: -- this president (ph).

SCHULTZ: Absolutely.

PASCRELL: We cut the deficit in half. And they won`t agree. Look, they`re not going to give them a pat on the back of the president for anything. It doesn`t matter what it is, Ed, and you and I are going to talk to a blow in the face it ain`t going to work.

SCHULTZ: Well --

PASCRELL: So, what we need to do is reconcile our differences by Thursday.

SCHULTZ: Here`s the best place in my opinion for the Democrats. There`s this thing called the continuing resolution that passed in the Senate.

Boehner has to bring it to the floor.

PASCRELL: He won`t do it.

SCHULTZ: OK, then we default? I mean, it`s on them, it`s on their party, and this is the way it is. I hate to look at it that way but this is -- because this means that they`re going to be able to come back to this point again, again and again, and do the default, do the shutdown to get what they want, to piecemeal it right back, and slowly try to get the American people on their side. This --

PASCRELL: Knowing what he`s dealing with, I think he should have known from the very beginning that there are certain members of his party that are never going to agree on anything.

SCHULTZ: Yes.

PASCRELL: Because if you give the one thing, it`s not enough to go to the next thing. This is performance over the last two and a half years. I`m not making this stuff up. Look in the record.

SCHULTZ: No, that`s true. Mitch McConnell, not an honest broker, not on the record number of filibusters in all of his state that goes (ph) politically. Congressman, great to have you with us tonight, I appreciate your time.

PASCRELL: Always a pleasure, Ed.

SCHULTZ: Thank you, sir.

PASCRELL: Thank you.

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