Hardball - Transcript

MSNBC
SHOW: HARDBALL 19:00

August 10, 2004 Tuesday

TRANSCRIPT: # 081000cb.461

HEADLINE: HARDBALL For August 10, 2004

BYLINE: Chris Matthews; David Shuster; Norah O'Donnell

GUESTS: Sen. Saxby Chambliss; Rep. Ellen Tauscher; Steve McMahon; Rick Davis; Vaughn Ververs; Dana Priest
MATTHEWS: Republican senator Saxby Chambliss of Georgia is a member of the Senate Intelligence Committee. Senator Saxby, what do you think of this appointment?

SEN. SAXBY CHAMBLISS (R-GA), INTELLIGENCE COMMITTEE: Chris, I think it's a great appointment by the president. Porter Goss, as you just heard, brings a very unique perspective with a background that's wide-ranging in the intelligence community.

And there's one thing that hasn't been pointed out that's critically important. We're in the middle of a war. The intelligence-gathering aspect is the most critical part of that war. Porter Goss, because of his experience in the intelligence community, knows all the players around the world. He can pick up the phone and call any one of the intelligence chiefs of our allies and say, This is Porter calling, and he'll have his phone call answered. They have a trusting relationship.

And I think Porter's an excellent choice by the president. It'll be difficult. That's part of the debate process. But at the end of the day, I'm confident Porter will be confirmed.

MATTHEWS: Does he need the trust of the other side politically in this country, the Democrats on Capitol Hill?

CHAMBLISS: I think he does. And I think Porter has earned their respect over the years. Sure, he's an elected Republican official. He's an advocate for his policies. But he's done his advocating in a very respectful way. And there are some who will be critical of him and try it politicize this, but I think that's wrong. I think this is an opportunity for both sides to come together and do what's in the best interests of the intelligence community, thus what's in the best interests of the American people.

MATTHEWS: Well, that's the question, Senator, whether the president has done so in this case because I've grown up with-as you have, with a very bipartisan, even nonpartisan approach to the CIA directorship. You had-Ike had Alan Dulles, who was John Foster Dulles's brother. But Alan Dulles was kept on by John F. Kennedy, who replaced him with a Republican. George Tenet was appointed by Clinton. He was held over by President Bush. That bipartisanship seems to be gone now with Porter Goss, who's an out-and-out hawk on the war, a Bush supporter, a critic of John Kerry's policies. I mean, how can you call him in any way consistent with the tradition of nonpartisanship?

CHAMBLISS: Well, certainly, President Bush 41 was-I don't think you consider him nonpartisan, as such. And he did an excellent job--

MATTHEWS: Well, he went to Jimmy Carter--

CHAMBLISS: --as the director of the CIA.

MATTHEWS: No, but he-he was following in that tradition. He went to Jimmy Carter in 1976 and asked to be kept on. I mean, there was that tradition. I mean, Carter didn't keep the tradition up, either, because he didn't keep him. But there was a long-term tradition.

CHAMBLISS: The fact of the matter is that everything in Washington right now is political. I don't care who the president would have nominated, there would have been cries from the other side that it was a political appointment. So you know, we have to take this in perspective if where we are in today's world and the election process. And Chairman Goss knows and understands that this is an administration appointment. He is responsible to the president.

MATTHEWS: Right.

CHAMBLISS: He serves at the pleasure of the president. And he's got to have the-give advice and consent to the president but follow the direction of the administration.

MATTHEWS: If Kerry wins the election, is there any likelihood at all that he would keep on someone as partisan as Mr. Goss?

CHAMBLISS: Well, that's something that-if that unfortunate thing should happen, we'd have to deal with it. But you know, we're at a critical juncture in the war on terrorism. We need stability. We need some leadership in place. And while John McLaughlin's a great guy and a good friend and has been a great asset to the CIA, we need somebody that we know is going to be there for some period of time in a permanent capacity.

MATTHEWS: Well, you're absolute politically, Senator. You must know that by making this appointment now, in mid-August, that the president will now face confirmation hearings between now and the election which will be opening up a can of worms about 9/11 and the lack of preparedness for that, in terms of the CIA's role. It'll bring up-open up another can of worms with regard to the bad intel, you could argue, with regard to the Iraq war, about weapons of mass destruction that haven't been found yet.

Is this an opportune time? I know you say there's an urgency to get a DCI in place, but doesn't this give an opportunity to the other side, Jay Rockefeller, the ranking member on your committee, to just raise hell between now and election day?

CHAMBLISS: Unfortunately, Chris, the scenario you just laid out's going to be followed anyway because we're going to have the hearings and debate on the 9/11 commission recommendations. And we should. And I think that all ought to be a part of the confirmation process of Chairman Goss. And let's lay it out. Let's find out what his ideas really are. And let's find out what he thinks about reforms, for example. I think I know, and I think he's willing to be very reasonable. And at the end of the day, I think there are going to be a number of Republicans who are going to recognize that we've got to make wholesale changes.

MATTHEWS: Right.

CHAMBLISS: Now, that's not being partisan, but it's a way that we can join together in a bipartisan way to make those major changes.

MATTHEWS: Does Porter Goss know that he will possibly, if there is reform, report to someone higher in the intelligence committee, a national intelligence director?

CHAMBLISS: I haven't asked him about that, obviously, but he's got to realize that the role of the director of the CIA is going to change. We're going to have a director of national intelligence. The exact role of that person will dictate what the role of the director of the CIA is. Now, I think the president was very careful today. Depending on what the outcome of these reforms are, it may be that this position evolves into the director of national intelligence. I don't know the answer to that, but I think it gives us the opportunity to debate this, and Congress in a bipartisan way can make that decision, along with the administration. And it may be that the director of the CIA evolves into the director of national intelligence.

MATTHEWS: You mean he may end up being the top guy.

CHAMBLISS: Yeah. He may be the top guy. I mean, there will always be two positions, but at this point in time, he may evolve into the top person.

MATTHEWS: OK. Well, great. Thanks for having-thanks for having you on-I mean, thank you for coming on, Senator Saxby Chambliss of Georgia--

(CROSSTALK)

CHAMBLISS: Always good to be with you, Chris.